Ep. 110 💫 Crystal’s Butterfly Effect: A Mother’s Journey Through Loss, Healing & Spiritual Awakening (Part 1)

In Part 1 of this two-part series on the Grief Talk Podcast, I was honoured to sit down with Vickie Menendez, transformational guide and author of Crystal’s Butterfly Effect. In this deeply moving conversation, Vickie shares her extraordinary journey of finding meaning and purpose in her life after losing four of her five children – each a separate, unimaginable loss that most of us could never fully comprehend.

With compassion and courage, Vickie reminds us that healing isn’t a destination, but a sacred unfolding to teach us how to find light in the darkest places. Through her work guiding others, she offers comfort and encouragement to anyone walking this path of grief. And by her sheer presence demonstrating profound humility, Vickie demonstrates that love can transcend all tragic loss when we surrender to its power.🕊️

✨ Highlights of Our Conversation:

• The Journey of Loss: From her first stillborn daughter in 1980 to the more recent losses of her son Wesley in 2017 and her daughter Crystal in 2023, the resilience of a mother’s love and the evolution of Vickie’s spiritual awakening.
• Healing as a Lifelong Process: Vickie shares the ebbs and flows of grief and why taking steps back is still part of moving forward.
• Radical Forgiveness and Gratitude: Vickie explains how practicing gratitude and forgiveness played a critical role in her healing journey.
• Soul Contracts and Finding Meaning and Purpose: Vickie and Vonne explore the belief that our souls choose their journeys, and we can find lessons in loss.
• Crystal’s Butterfly Effect: Vickie recounts her 48-day vigil by her daughter’s bedside and her deepening spiritual revelations while saying good-bye.

💖 This episode is a heartfelt testament to the enduring love and deep connection even in afterlife between a mother and her children and that even in grief, healing and hope are possible.

🎧 Listen now on your favorite podcast platform and join Vonne and Vickie for this transformative conversation about unimaginable loss, but also the enduring love from the unbreakable bond with our children lost through our soul connection.

#GriefTalkPodcast #HealingThroughLoss #SpiritualAwakening

Connect with Vickie:
https://vickiemenendez.com/

Connect with Vonne:
https://vonnesolis.com/

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Chapters

• 0:00 Welcome.
• 1:06 Vickie’s Journey and Losses.
• 6:17 Vickie's Healing Journey and Philosophy.
• 12:47 The Impact of Child Loss.
• 18:09 The Loss of Wesley, Vickie’s Dad, Gratitude and Forgiveness.
• 33:35 Crystal's Passing, Her Legacy and Vickie's Spiritual Awakening.
• 53:57 The Final Good-bye and Reflections.
• 1:02:42 Closing.

Transcript

Vonne Solis  0:00  
This is the Grief Talk Podcast with Vonnne Solis, helping you heal after loss and life's hardest hits.

Vonne Solis  0:07  
My guest today is Vickie Menendez. Vickie is a transformational guide, speaker and the author of Crystal's Butterfly Effect. Vickie's journey began with the stillbirth of her daughter in 1980 quietly opening the door to her spiritual path. The loss of her son, Wesley in 2017, and then tragically, losing two more children just 12 days apart in 2023 gave Vickie full awareness and clarity of her life's mission, which was to help others walk through loss and return to life with purpose and grace. With over 35 years in self-care and holistic wellness, Vickie now supports others through one-on-one soul guidance, healing communities and experiential workshops to gently guide her clients to feel again and begin to reimagine their lives with meaning, as part of her learning to live again movement.

Vonne Solis  1:06  
So Vickie, welcome to the Grief Talk podcast. I am honoured, honoured to have you here. And audience, Vickie and I had a little conversation before I hit the record button. So we do have a lot of things in common. What we don't have in common is the loss of multiple children, but almost everything else Vickie, I just feel like I told you, we're kindred spirits, soul sisters in the sense of choosing this, this, these, these tough, tough, tough experiences. Child loss. Worst experience people can imagine. And I know, I just know you will have heard that throughout your many years of being a bereaved mom.

Vonne Solis  1:45  
So today, audience, we're just gonna, I'm gonna let you, Vickie, as we talked, just talk about what you really want to share with my audience. We have a growing audience on this podcast because, as I've said many times, there's still no directory on any of the podcast platforms for grief and bereavement. So you have to fit it into education and inspiration and you know, religion spiritual, those are my three categories. So I would like to see, before I give up on this, I would like to see that change so people can go right in and learn from bereaved parents of you know whom I've had on my podcast, each with their own message, but no one as stunning in their story as you Vickie. So if you just want to pop in and say quick hello to my audience, I will get you started with your first question right after that.

Vickie Menendez  2:41  
Thank you so much for inviting me, Vonne. I, I'm so happy to be here to talk about my experience. You know, I, I talk about what has happened to me over a lifetime, to hopefully inspire other people that there is, there is healing. There is a way to healing. There's no destination healed. You know? There is no destination where you can say, Okay, now I'm done. I'm healed, because that pain and that loss will always be with you. It's just, how do we, what kind of definition do we give it? How do we dance with the emotions that rise up from time to time? Because some days we're really great, and some days we can be deep in grief. So sometimes we feel like we're taking a step back, but I'm sure that we'll get into this a little bit further as we as we get into conversation, but, and that's something that I'll explain a little bit later, but you are far from taking a step back when you do, when you do have those times where you feel like you're you've gone back into the cocoon, you know, to do more work.

Vonne Solis  4:00  
Yeah. Yeah. So audience, stay with me if you are a bereaved parent, for sure, mom or dad. Want to learn more about supporting a bereaved parent. As I said to Vickie prior to recording, I have only ever spoken in my 20 years as a bereaved mom due to the loss of my daughter to suicide in 2005, and it was actually at a support group, the Compassionate Friends function, and she had lost two children. And back then, that was about, you know, basically, 19, 20 years ago. And back then I was like, Oh my goodness. Like so. But what that did was set me on a path immediately to really understand, in person, you can lose more than one child, holy crap. And you know, it really did always put me sort of on guard with my surviving son and something I still have a little trouble with, but I found tools to manage that. Basically, largely activate the Find me on the iPhone, which at 33 he has graciously allowed me to do. I can't tell you how freeing that has been for me to know he's safe. He's still okay. And I hope that doesn't last till the end of my life. But if it does, it does. So like you said, Vickie, we're going to jump into it.

Vonne Solis  5:13  
We are going to shape this conversation folks watching or listening to this in terms of always remembering healing is possible. Vickie and I have done that. Your your more recent losses, as I'll remind folks, but I'll let you tell it, have been as as really recently as 2023 where you did lose two adult children. And prior to that, 2017 another adult son, a younger adult son. And then 1980 when you had a stillborn daughter who you believe reincarnated as one of your children, if you want to even talk about that, because I think that's so cool, and some people might be comforted by that. And so I just want to ask you to jump in Vickie, wherever you want to start, and then we're going to weave in the healing and the inspiration in whatever way you want to because I also know you're a Soma level three instructor and a map coach is it? You do mapping? Again, folks. Vickie is the author of a recently, more recently released book.

Vickie Menendez  6:15  
Crystal's Butterfly Effect.

Vonne Solis  6:17  
Okay, so Vickie, having explained all that, why don't you just jump in where you feel comfortable with your story, and as mentioned, we will weave in as we're called to, and you're called to the healing bits. The inspirational hope bits, because it's just the two are so entwined. So I'll let, I'll turn it over to you wherever you'd like to start.

Vickie Menendez  6:37  
Um, well, I mean the first loss. If we go way back to 1980 losing a stillborn at 20, I wasn't very far along with my awareness or consciousness level at that point, and didn't really know how to process something like that. And so it was years even after having all three of the other children that passed, there was always that fear around them being born. And you know, all of that was there's there was the excitement about being pregnant, but also the fear about something happening during birth, or something like that. So but, and it was probably a good five years before I could really talk about Leslie, and because, you know, went into the doctor one day. He couldn't find a heartbeat. So I went into the hospital knowing that she wasn't coming home with me. And I held her. I just traced every inch of her body, and especially like her face. Held her hand. You know, I think I saw her whole life flash before my eyes in just a matter of minutes. And so I left, left the hospital with a lock of her hair and her footprint, and that was it. 

Vickie Menendez  8:01  
And years later, I was talking to someone. I really started getting into spiritual, spirituality and all of that kind of thing. And I was talking to this woman one day, and she said that, I asked her, I said, Could her soul come back around and come right back in and be it within Crystal? And she said, Yes, absolutely. That's a possibility. And the reason why, and lately, when I was started writing the book, I realized what a thread there was between the two of them because the cord got wrapped around Leslie's neck and it choked her. And my daughter had asthma her whole life. Which was a problem with breathing. So so I just really always felt like that they were one soul. You know that that she just came right back around. She was meant to be here, but she just wasn't meant to be here right then. You know that there was there was something there for me to learn, something for me to gain from that. And yeah.

Vonne Solis  9:16  
That was also in my family. That happened to one of my siblings, and same exact identical. So I just want to say a nod to those who might be watching this that have had a stillborn, you know, child at due date and or later. In my in-law's, case, it my brother and his wife, it was two weeks, the baby was two weeks late. It's just traumatic. They had to have a funeral. I don't know. Did you have to have a funeral for Leslie? And so I'm just saying this episode is not about that, but it could be an episode all on its own for those who may be hosting a podcast or something that you know, dedicate grief to this. Because I don't know, do they talk about it a lot in the circles you sort of are in Vickie?

Speaker 1  10:05  
No, I mean stillbirth. I definitely think that there's a lot of work that needs to be done around that, especially if you go in and you have other children and because for me, I realized only five years ago, that that the losing her at that time changed how I interacted with everybody in my life. You know? It wasn't that I didn't love them, it was that I loved at a distance. I was always had that fear like intertwined with it, and I wish that I'd known what I knew now, but that wasn't my path. You know, like I was supposed to learn it along the way and but some, some, I think there's a lot of work that you can do around that before you go on to have other children, so that you make sure that you're not imprinting other relationships with that experience.

Vonne Solis  11:05  
Okay, huge lesson what you just said right there, Vickie. Anyone listening to or watching this episode, huge what you just said. Do the work if you can. And a lot of people you know call the next child today a rainbow baby. And a lot of that, I think, might be from miscarriage, but also, you know, possibly from stillbirth. It's not something I sure see in the media a lot, and there are probably, I know that there are in Canada, are dedicated support groups to that. And they are not the same as support groups for losing adult children or older children, or we even have support groups whether your child died in a hospital or suicide. Two two very different things. And my experience has always been, and I think it remains, very limited support available in Canada. There is support, and it's growing, but it's still not what we what we need in the various areas of loss. So I just wanted to give a nod to that, because that was your first child lost and set the foundation, I'm just confirming with you, for a more in-depth look at your life. Would you say, at this point and within before or after, one or more of your remaining children from that marriage union? Because you do have a wonderful surviving son, and we want to give a nod to that. That you do, just like me, have a surviving son, and I know we're both very grateful for our boys in more ways than one, as tech experts and other things. But no, would you say your lessons began in what time frame after losing Leslie?

Speaker 1  12:47  
Well, that made me curious about about spirituality and that kind of thing and and why? You know, I always felt like, what did I do? You know? Why did I deserve this? And at the time, I had no idea about contracts or I didn't have I didn't have that enlightenment yet, and that came after Wesley in 2017. But no. It never goes away. I mean, I she that was 45 years ago in 1980 and I still get choked up when I talk about her at times, because that's something that I don't think mothers can ever forget. You know, they because there is like that, like I was saying earlier, their life, kind of flashes before your eyes. I had a baby book that had a lock of hair and her footprint, and that is it. There was no first teeth at, you know, at one or she walked at nine months or you know, there was none of those, those things that you typically write down in these books. No pictures in there. Nothing to to monitor her growth, or anything, because there was nothing after that day.

Vonne Solis  14:07  
Yeah, and I'm pausing here, ooph! Because I think what you're talking about is so important, because you had to have the funeral, as did my you know, my family. Have to have the funeral for this was a boy. And then, you know, some people might just say, well, now just get over it. You can have more kids. Or you do have more children, and somehow you have to integrate that grief that you don't even understand at 20 years old, my God, with having more children. And so for people that might be tuning into this, and you know, maybe have had the same experience, and they're not allowed to talk about it, or they feel they can't talk about it because it wasn't important enough. I don't know. I don't know how they measure grief, and certainly how they measure it in terms of child loss. So what, what would you want to say to moms, looking back, try and and deal with that and come to terms with that moving forward to have more children?

Vickie Menendez  15:17  
I think that, like I was saying earlier, I was standing at the grave site, and my husband said, Oh, you could have other ones. Like it was nothing. And so it's really hard to to talk to people about it when they think, well, they never lived. You know, like, if that, there's just not as much emphasis put on the loss, you know, like we still had a loss. A big loss.

Vonne Solis  15:46  
Yeah, for sure. So, so I'll leave this part of our talk with just recognizing and honouring that these losses are very important, and more work needs to be done in this area, certainly in your country, the US, and certainly in Canada and probably around the world. And so we're honouring all those babes that came. Almost made it and and I believe - tell me what you think - that the soul decides. Like, okay, years ago, I read years and years and years ago that we can consider life, regardless of biology, in the spiritual sense, when soul enters the body. And if they are born, stillborn or die, SIDS, or, you know, something like this, that in the Spiritual kind of teachings, it would be that the soul has vacated the body and has decided that this wasn't a good fit for them, and they're going to come back. Which is a beautiful segue into what you believe about Leslie becoming at least part of Crystal, if, if not, coming back as Crystal.

Vickie Menendez  16:57  
Yeah. I, I really think, you know, in years later, I've only put the two together, but you know the way Leslie went out with the cord getting wrapped around her neck and taking her breath away, just it was like that connection with my daughter with Crystal, having asthma her whole life. Having all these issues with her breath. So um, and well, I came to that conclusion as I was writing the book. I was like, Oh, wow, there's another, because I was writing my my chapter on synchronicities, and that's when I kind of put those that two together. Like I had been thinking about her soul coming back into Crystal and that gave me a lot of solace for many years. Like I felt like I have her.

Vonne Solis  17:50  
Yeah for sure, yeah for sure. I get that.

Vickie Menendez  17:53  
It helped a lot because I thought, you know, I just didn't feel like I was (indecipherable) that she didn't come back through in Crystal.

Vonne Solis  18:03  
Yeah.

Vickie Menendez  18:03  
So, I didn't really put the two together about the breath until I started writing the book. 

Vonne Solis  18:06  
So let's move into, let's move into Vickie, what you want to share about, I note in your book, you didn't talk, at least I didn't pick up that you talked a lot about Wesley's passing in 2017. And if I'm correct, that was a drug overdose? And you found him. And I'm not gonna, I'm not going to, I just want to acknowledge that again, the next time you lost a child was 2017. So you got 1980, 2017. Um, and so I just want to pay respect and homage to Wesley. You do talk about him as a brilliant artist, and I appreciate that. My daughter was very gifted as well. And sometimes I think that these children, just the world, can be too much for them. And the other thing I want to say as a shout out and from the suicide things I just sadly, sadly, sadly, read yesterday that in my province of British Columbia, the suicide rates for age nine to 25 has not diminished in the last few years, and they recognize there are no supports. And that is probably true across the country, and probably true elsewhere around the globe, because in when you study, when you study those statistics, they don't change much around the globe. Anyway, so just a nod to

Vickie Menendez  18:08  
That is so sad.

Vonne Solis  18:47  
Yeah, the youngest I've heard is that has gone is 10. And so, you know. And so whatever way our children go, I just want to make the point here that whatever way our children go, most of us as bereaved parents don't sit there and go, Well, how did your kid die? How did you? We don't. We just all sort of, we understand the pain of that loss and so, but sometimes we need answers, and when it's drug overdose and things like that and we can feel responsible. When it's medical. I don't know. Maybe you still feel responsible, which we're going to get into a little bit but in those cases, so if it's drug overdose. If it is a suicide. If it's something that you felt, that you did really poorly as a parent, I just want to know Vickie, if, in what the impact of Wesley and then the seven years until your next big lessons, what were you learning in that period from Wesley's passing?

Vickie Menendez  18:50  
After Wesley passed you know, I think, although I had been through 30 years of Tony Robbins you know, like that kind of of learning, but what I learned after Wesley was how to really process emotions. And because I still after him, my dad died, you know, the year after him, in 2018 and I quickly realized that I thought I was handling it. Because I thought, you know, oh, when you just get up and you just keep moving forward, but I wasn't really honouring the emotions that I had and really embracing them. And that's one thing I learned after I started my healing journey. Like Wesley's contract was I think it was three-fold. He left a piece of art for me in his in his apartment. And that piece of art had his entire life on the one piece of art.

Vonne Solis  18:50  
Wow.

Vickie Menendez  18:50  
One side was all of the things that he wanted. The other side was all of the things that was pulling him back into the dark. You know to the dark side.

Vonne Solis  19:10  
Yeah, I saw that picture. I just want to say. I went to your website and looked at it because it's on your website.

Vickie Menendez  20:25  
Yeah, in the book it's a little hard to see because it's so small, but there was a message there, and it was to both the parents of addicts and to the addicts. And parents of addicts, there's more to the child than the drug, and sometimes we think that's all they think about. But in that piece of art, I could tell that he still had hopes and dreams. And he still wanted that happy family. He wanted that baby. He wanted, you know, to be successful in love. And sometimes they don't talk about it because they're afraid of being judged because if we're in the middle of an addiction, who's gonna believe that? You know? They don't believe it. You know? They have those feelings, those wants and desires. But even they have doubts that they can get out of, where, where they are in, in the addiction. And then if the parents have given up on them, as some parents do. You know, I mean, it's really difficult to watch your child go through that and so some people think, oh, tough love, you know, just disconnect. And we, we're all energetic beings, right?

Vonne Solis  23:18  
Yeah.

Vickie Menendez  23:18  
So if our parents have given up on us, they feel that. A child will feel that, and then they give up on themselves, you know, like, why even try? Because if my parents are giving up on me then that's something that they feel energetically. And after looking at that piece of art, I was like, wow, I had not given up on  Wesley. But you know, you want your like, until I learned things from my healing journey and learned all these new tools around processing grief and processing, emotions and that kind of thing there was always that thought, What if I had done this?

Vonne Solis  23:59  
Yeah.

Vickie Menendez  23:59  
What if I had done that? You know, what if's does absolutely nothing for your present situation because they're gone. And there's absolutely nothing that you can do about that.

Vonne Solis  24:10  
Did you, I just have to ask, did you feel like you had done bad job with Wesley, and you resolved that, you know, in the following years past, you know, post his transition? Or that you'd let him down?

Vickie Menendez  24:28  
I probably felt like that until I started on my healing journey. And there's two things that I did that brought me into the contracts and how we cross paths with people.

Vonne Solis  24:45  
Yeah.

Vickie Menendez  24:45  
I, there for a long time though it was, like, you know, what could I done differently and questioning, you know because I felt like I did as much as I could do to connect with him.

Vonne Solis  24:58  
Yeah.

Vickie Menendez  24:58  
He spent a decade with a lot of people in his family.

Vonne Solis  25:03  
 Yeah.

Vickie Menendez  25:05  
And I, and, like you were saying earlier, I think artists, are they are they work on such a different plane all together, with their how they feel, how their mind works, and that that I think sometimes they do have a hard time living on Earth's planet. You know, like they're just in an altogether different place. But I read Radical Forgiveness.

Vonne Solis  25:35  
Yeah.

Vickie Menendez  25:35  
And did 28 days of gratitude. Those two things changed my whole perception about life and death. Showing gratitude, for the little things. You know, we we think we show gratitude for a lot of things, but when you get into a gratitude challenge, and you have to come up with 10 new gratitude examples every day and you start showing gratitude for the most minute things. We don't show gratitude for that water tap turning on every time we turn the handle, or having a hot shower or food in your refrigerator, or even having a stove. You know, those things that just seem like these everyday things that everybody has right? But, have doing the gratitude challenge, and you read, especially reading Radical Forgiveness by Colin Tripping changed my whole perception on the people that cross our paths. You know, we tend to to see only victimhood sometimes when people do things, say things to us that that trigger us in some way. After reading that book, I realized that these triggers are our opportunities to heal, whether it's things from this lifetime or maybe generational trauma that we've brought in with us.

Vonne Solis  27:02  
Hm mmm. Oh. One thing I want to just say about the gratitude piece is, and what I teach in my work is that if you can't feel it, you can't feel it. Don't try and force yourself. It ain't gonna work. You wait until that nudging, and it's a very emotional sort of shift that where you, you know, can start to truly, the gratitude you're talking about? Truly, truly feel it. They might as well call it radical gratitude and radical forgiveness. It's sort of the same where it's, you know, it's, it's very it's a big ask to feel gratitude when you're a bereaved parent. Pretty big ask. And I mean, I mean, there's things that you know you're living, your surviving children, of course. But there's, you know, you feel gratitude for that, your family, for this, that, and the other thing but a real gratitude for me. And the shift was when I could feel gratitude for what I learned from the loss. That was a big shift for me. And that is an internal thing where you start to get your lessons and things like that. All of which I know you have gone through and written about in your beautiful book.

Vonne Solis  28:14  
So you were on your journey and dove into self-discovery, healing from the loss of Wesley and then your dad, and that must have had an impact. I also lost my parents, both my parents within, well, my dad, 15 months after my daughter, and then my mom, a shock death in 2010. So five years later, and so there was a lot of loss. And her biological father died, I think it was 2011 so, you know, there was a lot of loss around that. Is there anything you want to giving a nod to your dad, also, that you want to talk about with how that also played into your search, your life search and for lessons and healing?

Vickie Menendez  29:07  
You know the shock of finding Wesley when he was not in very good state. Like he was already decomposing by the time I found him there. Which is sight that you can't unsee. You can't unsee your child. And you know, my first thought was, that he was alone here, all this time. But then, you know, after like and then, you know, losing my dad a year later, it really kind of pushed me over the edge. And I knew that I just felt so heavy. I was looking at some old pictures of myself and or not so old. Like at the time they were fairly recent. And I was smiling but there was pain all, written all over my face, and I could see it. At that time, I remember just having pain from head to toe. Like I was having aches and pains and my joints hurt. And, all of those things can acompany grief and people don't realize that that's part of the grieving process. You know, your emotions just get stored and they lodge in your your tissues, your organs. If you don't learn how to deal with those emotions, how to process that, they might even manifest as cancer. It can manifest in parts, into you know you go the doctor, and they're, oh well, you have rheumatoid arthritis, and they want to give you all of this medication for when sometimes it's just emotional trappings that we have in our body.

Vickie Menendez  30:48  
If you think about it, okay, when my son died, I was 58. I had been carrying Leslie around with you for all of those years, even though I thought that her soul came back, it was still that element of loss that I was still carrying around with me, related to her.  And then, you know, with my dad right after him, it just it compounded it enough that I just I felt so heavy and so weighted down that that was part of this contract with me, was to nudge me into my healing. Because there is no way I would be sitting here talking to you today had I not went through that couple of years of really working hard on learning how to process emotions. How to just to get back to a state of joy again before the two kids passed, because they passed twelve days apart. I don't know if you know that.

Vonne Solis  31:51  
I do know that. I just, I want to let you tell your story. So the point I want to make for the audience is that if you're a bereaved parent, your our journeys evolve, you know. I was thinking about you, Vickie, okay this morning, and our journeys evolve differently and uniquely. And sometimes we can think we need to be in a place where other people are? And we don't. We can't. Because whatever we believe in, even if we believe the same things. Like you and I have similar beliefs in that, our losses are contracts, soul contracts, and there are lessons from it. And then in both our cases, you know, we're turning it around to be authors and do inspirational work and help others and so on and so forth. But we both come from more of a metaphysical, spiritual foundation. How we got there doesn't matter. We're there. But still, what you're doing, what I'm doing, are completely different. And I also believe that our sort of, how do I want to say this. Fulfilling that contract from our end, okay? I think that can evolve too. And, and I was telling you, and I will say it as a shout out, in case anyone else is going through this or but just to give you hope and inspiration, or even just some, oh, fun! Is that I'm actually moving more into understanding afterlife and blending timelines from previous incarnations and living them, where my daughter is able to give me physical signs of her presence. Right here, right here.

Vonne Solis  33:35  
So that was a shift that happened to me a year ago and helped me kind of refine my purpose, which is probably to do something, something to do with timeline healing. I'm working with someone in that area, and also to understand afterlife very differently. Because when you get signs, and Vickie, I know you get signs. And we're going to turn to Crystal and your 48 day vigil, and there were some major shifts for you going on there. And so you've been blessed with signs of afterlife, and also your grandchildren. And your one grandson, specifically, right? But each of Crystal's children feel her presence. And so I would like to talk a little bit about that, but it it, we can still question those signs. And Vickie, I want to get your thoughts on it, on, on this, and then to share what, what your 48 what, what impacted you the most. You write so beautifully about your vigil beside Crystal. So whatever you know, if you however much you want to share about what led Crystal to be in hospital. To have that vigil. Your spiritual, I don't know if you want to call it a further awakening, holy smoly. Understanding the purpose. Wow! The contract and your thoughts on afterlife.

Vickie Menendez  34:59  
Well, I really feel like that Crystal and I had conversations about spirituality and things. They were so connected. Her, her children, her husband, all connected on a different level. And I think that's a reason why she lives with them in so many different ways. I mean you remember about the little helicopter, when it just comes to life in, in their their cabin, and

Vonne Solis  35:30  
It was a drone, right? Was it a little drone? Yeah.

Vickie Menendez  35:33  
Yeah. A little drone. And they were both sittiing there on the table and they're all looking at it like, okay.

Vonne Solis  35:39  
And it starts flying around the cabin, right?

Vickie Menendez  35:42  
Yes, yes. And then one day they, it was in the middle of the night and it's dark. They could hear things like moving around, like somebody's tripping over stuff. And then they heard giggles. And a friend of my daughter's actually had lost two children, and Crystal was like her best friend. And she took her life about a month after Crystal passed. And they felt like they could hear them, and they felt like they were together. And they were there you know, just letting them know that they were there. But in her hospital room, I walked into the hospital with a totally dif different understanding of why I was there. Now, if this had happened a few years before that, I wouldn't have had the awareness, the consciousness level, that I had at that point, because I wouldn't have gone through that healing journey. If I did not have that under my belt, I might have gone in and just thrown judgement of, why did you take her the hospital and why? Why? Why? And, you know, I would have been a victim in it, or whatever, and I walked in to the hospital room just wanting to create a sacred space for her. Because this was all about Crystal. This was all about what she was going through and the work that I knew that she was still doing from the hospital bed. She was in a coma that whole time and never communicated like we're communicating. 

Vonne Solis  37:20  
Yeah, I just want to pop in so to give context. So she had had a medical emergency and put off going to the hospital. And was this not like on Christmas Eve? Christmas Eve day in02022, and so she prolonged, for whatever reason, and you write about it in your book, going to the hospital, and by the time she got to the hospital, what I wasn't clear about Was she in a coma by the time she got to the hospital, or did they put her in a medical coma?

Vonne Solis  37:43  
She went into cardiac arrest. 

Vonne Solis  37:48  
Cardiac arrest.

Vickie Menendez  37:53  
On her way to the hospital and then they were able to bring her back. But by then, she had been under for so long that she was having seizures and all of that. And that's the reason why they put her in the induced coma, because she was having lots of seizures and stuff, one right after the other. And so we thought with time that, you know. I mean, I only study the cases where the patients came back full, you know, like fully healed. Where the doctors were saying they would never walk again, talk again, you know, they would never wake up again. And they did. You know, those are the cases that I look at. I didn't look at the cases where people die. I wanted to keep the energy in in a positive note, you know, like anything is possible, right?

Vonne Solis  38:52  
So here's a question. Here's a question, Vickie. So your city, it was 48 days, right? A 48 day vigil. And other family, her hubby came in and stuff, but you did not leave her side, except maybe to rest a little bit or whatever. So I commend you. And as I told you before we started this recording, which, by the way, feels like a month ago now, but anyway, that you know, it was so poignant. It did make me, you know, have tears and you know, want to cry, because you bring me right you bring the reader like right there with you, and you write so beautifully and so poignantly. But here's a question for you. Were you in that time that, of course you want her, of course you want her to wake up and be Crystal. At the same time with your spiritual practice and the healing, you know, that had taken place for you, and how you may have come to understand Wesley's passing at this point, seven years later. Were you able to, you know, accept that it was her journey, and if she was going to let go, man, she was going to let go and go?

Vickie Menendez  40:04  
Absolutely. And I always had the hope you know, of course, that she would defy all odds. But I also knew that at some point, and it was - there's a story that I have to tell you, because this is, this was gonna kind of help bring everything together, I think. But after 30 days, the doctors were like, You need to make a decision at this point. You know, she because she had asked for 30 days.

Vonne Solis  40:29  
Yeah.

Vickie Menendez  40:30  
It was crazy. Her and her husband were watching a movie or something, and somebody was in the hospital or whatever, and they were talking about that very subject. How much time would you want me to give you if you were, like, plugged up to electrical equipment, and you know, you needed that to live. And she said I would want 30 days. So when the 30 days came up, she we'd have to decide. And of course, the insurance was all over us, because she was in CCU for for 30 days, so that was mounting up, and they just didn't see her being able to get any better. So I was went home because I knew that I didn't want to leave her side until we were all done. Until she had passed. And so I went back. I was going back to get some clothes. I was in the car. I was talking to my husband on the phone, and he's like, I don't want you to be there when she dies. I just think that's going to be too much for you to handle. And I said, Where else would I be? You know, except by her side. And I said, so when I got off the phone with him, I was crying, and I was on my way to the hotel to get my clothes. And all of a sudden, I feel this energy just come through my back and out, out of my body like this whoosh, like all of a sudden. I mean, it actually moved my body. And I felt like I was vibrating from head to toe. And for just a moment, I felt this sadness and then all of a sudden, I was laughing. And I'm like, How can I be laughing right now? And then I realized that it's Crystal. It's her energy. Yeah, she was telling me. She said, Mom, I'm more than okay.

Vonne Solis  42:39  
Yeah.

Vickie Menendez  42:40  
 So that she was free, you know that she was just that she was fine, and that she was better than okay. And,

Vonne Solis  42:51  
Yeah, because for the audience, again, she did have some medical challenges in life and some limitations, right? And they had severely, I mean, again, you write about this, but they had impacted her in a way that I don't know if it was frustrating for her. But it wasn't, like life wasn't like she was struggling a little bit with that, right?

Vickie Menendez  43:13  
Yep she was. Her hips. She had problems with both hips, and by 41, she had had two hip replacements.

Vonne Solis  43:21  
Wow.

Vickie Menendez  43:23  
With her second hip replacement just three months before that. And we had all of these plans, things that we were gonna do. She, you know, was barely able to get around for years. And we had all of these plans. You know, biking, to do this and that and now that she had her, her hips back and and it's just, you know, it was so sad just to see what took place. And, you know, like when she we talked earlier that day, and I thought, everything's fine. I had no idea that she'd had trouble breathing all day. She didn't tell me that. And so the hard thing and I wrote this in the book. Part of me thinks that her soul kind of held her back because her soul knew that this was time. They knew that their contact was coming to an end.

Vonne Solis  44:16  
Yeah.

Vickie Menendez  44:17  
Why, that she was just, for some reason, pulling back to the hospital because she'd been in the hospital hundreds of times with her asthma.

Vonne Solis  44:27  
Do you do you think that um, no. Did you in looking back, and I know it's pretty fresh, February 2023, but that, that the the emergency that that actually that. So I believe, I would believe that. So that's the emergency she created as part of her contract, and everything unfolded exactly the way it was meant to. And you were supposed to sit there for your 48 days, or however many days it would be, for someone. Like this is how, and I know, this is how I my spiritual practice has been taught to me over the decades. Same with you? Same with you? And so did she, like in looking back, I could see that my daughter, she, you know, she said her goodbyes to us. And even though it was a suicide, there were signs looking back, she was ready to leave the planet. And then after she died, she had created through photography, but it was digital, the most beautiful, spiritual art that told me she knew a whole lot more than she ever let on. Probably more than me, which is why she's my teacher. Did Crystal ever give you those signs that she was getting ready to leave the planet? Or you, I know you lived in different places, so it might have been harder. But do you think they were there? Like do you, I guess the real question I'm asking. Kids or not, our kids or not. Do you think we know when our time is coming to leave the planet? Do you think that's at least possible?

Vickie Menendez  46:06  
It could be possible. And I think it really depends on just how, where your awareness level

Vonne Solis  46:13  
Yeah.

Vickie Menendez  46:14  
level is.

Vonne Solis  46:15  
Yeah.

Vickie Menendez  46:16  
She was 2000 miles away from me, so there was a little bit of a disconnect that there, even though, you know, as mothers, you know, we have like this resonance with our children.

Vonne Solis  46:32  
Yeah.

Vickie Menendez  46:33  
So on a cellular level

Vonne Solis  46:34  
Yeah.

Vickie Menendez  46:35  
we you know, our mitochondria is shared. You know, all of these things are shared, and you can be, their presence in our body can be there for decades.

Vonne Solis  46:45  
I know.

Vickie Menendez  46:46  
(indecipherable). It feels like as mothers that we should know that they may not be here physically, but they are with us. They are us.

Vonne Solis  46:58  
Yeah.

Vickie Menendez  46:59  
Why energetically if we're all one.

Vonne Solis  47:01  
Oh, I for sure.

Vickie Menendez  47:03  
It's just the physical body that we're missing, but they are still within us.

Vonne Solis  47:08  
Yeah.

Vickie Menendez  47:09  
And um.

Vonne Solis  47:10  
So did, did you worry about her leaving the planet early? Like did was there any signs even for you? Because I always worried about my daughter. I really did. And I didn't look at it, listen, I at the time she only lived to 22. So I didn't look at it like, I am so worried she's going to take her life. No. But there was something, something for years and years and years that I don't feel with my son. That's a different worry. This one was a gnawing. This was an inner heaviness of real grief within me, in looking back and not understanding what grief really was. Kind of knowing, like I couldn't picture her future after a certain age, you know? Like I just and so I think at an innate and the day before she died, I, you know, I have my own story in that, in my own book Divine Healing. But it was so like I just I was so afraid for her. I think I was more afraid for me, because I really think I knew she was going. Did you ever have that fear about Crystal?

Vickie Menendez  48:18  
Well, I knew that she was really miserable with all of the pain that she was going through.

Vonne Solis  48:23  
Yeah.

Vickie Menendez  48:24  
And I guess if I had any fear, it would just be of her wanting to take her life like that you know? Because she just because I couldn't imagine having the level of pain that she had on a daily basis for years. Because some days I'll have pain. And I went through years where I had, like, head to toe pain. It was, it was horrible. And hers, you know, all in her hips and not really being able to move. She had issues bone to bone. And that is like, one of the hardest and the worst pains that you can experience. And I just, you know, I felt so helpless because no matter, I just felt like there was nothing I could do for her.

Vonne Solis  49:10  
Do you believe she's your teacher though, right?

Vickie Menendez  49:14  
Oh, yeah, absolutely. I mean our children pick us. We don't pick our children. Our children pick us.

Vonne Solis  49:22  
I agree.

Vickie Menendez  49:23  
They have a certain path that they were supposed to walk, and I, as their parent was supposed to allow them to walk their path.

Vonne Solis  49:34  
Yeah.

Vickie Menendez  49:35  
And while they were growing up, sometimes people thought one thing or the other like, oh, I should try to get them out of trouble when they're in trouble, or something like that. And I thought, no. They should learn your consequences. Feel it, you know so hopefully it won't happen again. So I never, like, just paid for their way out of any trouble that they might have gotten in. You know, my son, Wesley, got in trouble kind of, quite a lot, and in school and stuff like that. And I just felt like that, that there's consequences to your actions. And my belief is that they should, if they're willing to do the deed then they should be willing to face the consequences. And some people would think I was too lenient with them, you know. And so it's like I felt like, no matter what I did, that somebody was, you know, like judging me as a parent. But, but I after going through my healing journey, I go, well I was the parent that they chose. I was the parent 

Vonne Solis  50:41  
Yeah.

Vickie Menendez  50:41  
that they choose for them to go and walk the path that they had agreed to walk on the path that they had. The things that they had agreed to experience in this lifetime. And I don't think we know if we say, Okay, I'm going to experience profound loss. We don't know quite how that's going to show up, because it really depends on a lot of different factors. And what's surprising what is available to us at any given time, we don't know how that's going to show up, and we forget what we contracted to.

Vonne Solis  51:22  
Exactly.

Vickie Menendez  51:23  
When we come earth side, because otherwise we'd probably try to avoid it, right?

Vonne Solis  51:28  
Yeah.

Vickie Menendez  51:28  
Or wouldn't feel it completely, and we wouldn't feel it fully. And that is part of our our soul's growth is to feel everything. To feel the emotions, to feel what we came here to learn, you know in this lifetime. So.

Vonne Solis  51:45  
Yeah. I 100% agree. I just, I will add to that. So again, spiritual teachings are such that we do not remember, we're not really conscious of what we came here to learn. But if we look for the lesson. If we do become, you know, you know, take the spiritual path and listen, it could start as a kid as a yearning. Like I was always looking at the sky as a kid, you know, thinking there's got to be more. And it came from super dysfunction, super, super, super dysfunction. My mom tried suicide five, six times by that time I was 10. So I also believe that the childhood environments that we choose, and some of them could be super balanced and happy and most positive, and you don't have problems, and good for you if you got that life. I didn't. And you know, and it tied in completely with what would later in life, at 48 years old, traumatize me. Completely. And so now I've got this thing, you've got your stuff, and it's piling on and piling on, you know, and piling on. And it's kind of like, what more do I have to learn? What more am I supposed to see in this? And that is what becomes very individual and unique, and why we turn to spiritual tools and teachers and healing and energy work and all of this stuff, if you which never ends. Vickie. I think we were talking earlier about, you know it, the path is continually taking us whatever we have contracted to come here and take on for ourselves. And I just personally, for me, believe that it doesn't end until we transition. You might get a little like, a little break and a little rest. 

Vickie Menendez  53:31  
A little bit of a lull. You know?

Vonne Solis  53:33  
It doesn't all have to come from tragedy. I, right? And so there does come a point where do you think? So I want to quickly. I don't want to skim over it. The great, what was the greatest spiritual awakening that you had and write about when you're during this vigil with Crystal?

Vickie Menendez  53:57  
Well, Crystal when, when they put her in the comfort care, I came back, you know, had that experience. I came back to the room and I was like buzzing for hours. It took hours and hours for that feeling to go away. I was standing next to her bed and they were about to put her into the comfort care, which means they're just waiting to, they pull everything away. All of the sedation, everything, and they just wait for them to have heart attack. For them to have their hearts fail, whatever.

Vonne Solis  54:31  
Right.

Vickie Menendez  54:32  
And so I'm standing next to your bed, and her husband said I can't watch her die. And I said, Pete, you do what's right for you. And I really meant that. I said there's no judgment. Where maybe two years before that, I would have been judging him for that, you know? But I was, I really felt like that I was way beyond all of those lower level emotions and I told Pete he only needed to do what he needed to do for himself. He walks out of the hospital room. I was standing there with her, and five minutes later, he walks back into the hospital room where he said, Crystal turned me around  at the stairs. He said, we don't leave people behind.

Vonne Solis  55:16  
Oh, I just got chills. I remember reading that, but I'm just getting chills now. What a compassionate, it's like, if there could be any, any more compassionate message, and, you know, and she might have even been going in and out of afterworld at that point, do you know? But even if she wasn't, how beautiful and pure, you know?

Vickie Menendez  55:37  
At that moment, I felt a little ner and I was shocked, because I was like, Oh, crap, something's about to happen.

Vonne Solis  55:46  
Yeah.

Vickie Menendez  55:46  
Because, because Pete and I were not fans of each other.

Vonne Solis  55:51  
Ahh ha.

Vickie Menendez  55:52  
She put us in a room for five days straight 24/7, and we got to know each other. We got to lay down all of our judgments, all the stories that we knew about one another. And we really got to know each other. We ate together. We took care of Crystal. We took turns sleeping. You know, if I had to leave the hospital, then the boys were there. The two oldest boys. We always had somebody there with her, and so I knew when he walked back into the room, I thought, okay, there's some healing about to take place here.

Vonne Solis  56:30  
Yeah.

Vickie Menendez  56:31  
And so the next five days we really, she always wanted us to have a good relationship, and she knew that Pete would need me after she was gone, you know?

Vonne Solis  56:44  
And after you know, and hearing you talk, for those of us that believe in contracts. I believe there can be, like, you know, a major one, and then maybe other little sort of subcontracts. And so only you would know, only she would know what her real contract is. But because you're part of it, all the people in her her life are part of it, the more intimate, the relationships. So Pete will have had a contract with her. Maybe her sons would have had a contract, etc. And we can only know our part in the contract if we're lucky enough. Maybe you go to a channel who can tell you you know what their part was a little bit more. But ultimately, I I adopted years ago that it's not for me or anybody else to judge why my daughter left the planet, because I don't believe the doors will open to that death, transition unless they're meant to. I just, I just don't believe that. And the police told me my daughter had such an angelic face when they found like when they went in. And you can't fake that. You can't fake that. And I only ever saw her in, you know, the the funeral home, and she did look beautiful, beautiful. So who dies with a beautiful, angelic face, unless they're at peace in that transition, right? I mean, we should all be so lucky, right?

Vickie Menendez  58:15  
The day that she passed, and she had gone for 48 days of like

Vonne Solis  58:20  
Hell.

Vickie Menendez  58:21  
There was times when her medication would be wearing off, or something like that and she'd start having seizures and that kind of thing. And

Vonne Solis  58:30  
Yeah.

Vickie Menendez  58:31  
but the moment she took her last breath, I knew that that was her last breath. And when I got up, I took a moment though, and there's you're something that I think everybody might want to hear is how I sent her off. And it was in the book. Don't know if you remember reading it.

Vonne Solis  58:51  
Yeah.

Vickie Menendez  58:52  
But when I got up and looked at her before I tell you that story, her face was, it was, it was Angelic, just like you said. 

Vonne Solis  59:04  
Yep.

Vickie Menendez  59:04  
There was not this, this, this look that she went through a lot. She looked like she was just peacefully sleeping.

Vonne Solis  59:14  
Yeah.

Vickie Menendez  59:15  
And she had gone through 48 days of hell. When she passed, it was just like she was luminous. And but knowing that she was going to be passing, and the doctor, by the way, said she'll last a couple hours and maybe a couple of days. She lasted for 19 days.

Vonne Solis  59:37  
Yeah, I remember reading that.

Vickie Menendez  59:39  
I'm like, and they're shaking their head, and I'm like, You don't know my daughter. She's, she's spicy. She's, you know, she had worked to do. She still had work that she would not complete. She was trying to, like, wrap everything up and tie it in a little bow and,

Vonne Solis  59:56  
And this was the period. Was this the period? Period where you and Pete were healing together as well? Yeah, yeah. I mean, it's so beautiful you write in this book, "Yet as I kissed her forehead", this is in your heartfelt goodbye, "a serene wisdom filled me. She had crossed over into a realm where love knows no bounds. Her spirit, a beacon of joy and purity. And in her departure, she left behind" this is what I love, "she left behind the keys to a boundless love." Whoa, "teaching us that even in goodbye, there is a promise of presence, a whisper of reunion in the embrace of the infinite." I mean beautiful, beautiful. And I don't know if those words were channelled to you, as you in that moment reflecting back being part of that divine energy, it's almost a blessing to have experienced that Vickie.

Vickie Menendez  1:01:02  
When you think about where they are, that other realm.

Vonne Solis  1:01:07  
Yeah.

Vickie Menendez  1:01:08  
No, lower level emotions. All there is, is just pure essence, pure joy, pure love. That's it.

Vonne Solis  1:01:17  
Agreed.

Vickie Menendez  1:01:18  
That's how we we can settle into that and just because I love them more than I ever thought I did. You know, like you think you love your children. And then it's like that love just continues to grow, and you don't have to worry about them. You don't have to, you know, there's not no judgment, there's no arguments. Because I don't know about you, but I didn't have the perfect relationship with my daughter. There

Vonne Solis  1:01:50  
We

Vickie Menendez  1:01:50  
are times, you know, there's times when they're your your best friend, and other times you're going, you feel like, okay, what did I do now? And what and where we are right now is just pure love. And although I would so give my right arm for her to be here physically, this is what I have.

Vonne Solis  1:02:13  
 Yeah.

Vickie Menendez  1:02:14  
It's all I have now. You know, there's no, she's not gonna walk through that door, but I can just keep growing this love that I have for her. And just, you know, have her understand that I know that she is here to watch over me. To watch over her boys. Just to to be that Earth Angel you know that she is.

Vonne Solis  1:02:42  
Thanks for joining me with Vickie Menendez on this first part of her interview. Join us again for part two, airing November 12, 2025, Episode 111 on the Grief Talk Podcast, where Vickie talks about the loss of her fourth child, her son, Jesse, and the self-love, self care and healing that she's been on since then.